Thinking...

[Scott]

I have been giving serious thought into returning to reef keeping. A lot depends on what happens with work in the next few weeks but I have started planning.

The problem is that I don't think that I can support the tank that has been sitting empty in my living room for the past three (almost four) years. I have also have a lot of equipment that is for larger tanks but I think that I can use some of it. Here is a partial list of what I have:
250 watt DE metal halide with 14K bulb
Ballasts for VHO's and T-5's
Some LED lights that I had planned to use, one panel for a refugium and the other to supplement the MH
Calcium reactor, CO2 tank, gauges, PH monitor/solenoid
2 very large skimmers, one is a downdraft and the other is a Reef Mania PS2 (I think)
50+ lbs of live rock
Dolphin AM3000
Mag 5 and 12
Salt
RO/DI
80 gallon tank (24x36x24) stand and canopy
Miscellaneous items like TDS meters, powerheads, pumps, test kits, GFO, smaller sumps and who really know what else.

I have been out of the hobby for a while and I haven't done much research to get back into it. I am mostly going on what i remember from years ago. I know that I want a fairly simple set up, no Zeovit (if that is still even around) and no dosing vodka or any of that other crap that seemed to keep me busy researching what I could do better last time, even though it didn't do any good or at least once even did harm. I am thinking of a 29 gallon tank with a canopy but an open top where I can hang the MH fixture and not too much light will spill into the room. I would like a refugium but with such a small tank I imagine that the sump would not be large enough unless I did really low flow, which would mean i would have to have a closed loop or some type of powerheads. I would like to keep SPS and LPS but the LPS will be limited to those that I always liked, echinophyllias and a few other select LPS. So I could use the metal halide with either the VHO's or the T-5's for dawn/dusk. I was thinking the Mag 5 for return, calcium reactor for when I actually start with stonies. That leaves a lot to plan and I need to keep it somewhat simple because I am out of town a lot.

So, if you finished reading all of this, what would you do, keep and use, sell, hold on to for later, buy, trade for, trade with, etc to get back into reefkeeping. I am pretty sure that I will need a tank, sump and appropriate sized skimmer at a minimum (at least I could start a reef with just that and what I have).

So, what is your advice?

[Amphiprion]

Welcome back, Scott. It's been a while since you've posted, too. Glad to see you back in the hobby and on the board.

Everything you've listed should work for what you want to do, though there are a few things I would exclude or change. The skimmers will work fine, but at least one of them is bulky (I don't recall the Reef Mania skimmer), possibly both. Not so sure that would fit in your sump, depending on what kind of sump you use. There are a few others out there that may fit your application a bit better, but I'm not sure what kind of space you'll be working with. If you want a smaller tank, the mag 5 is plenty. As for the Ampmaster, I'd sell it for something like one of the new Vortech powerheads. I'd shoot for the full MP40 model, but the MP20 would work until things fill in. The new smaller Tunze Stream Gen 2 pumps would also be a legitimate option and a bit cheaper than the Vortech MP40, but slightly bulkier. Or you could shoot for a couple controllable Tunze Nanostreams, which may be the better option for more diverse, controllable flow in a smaller tank. Look into those and see which you'd prefer. Lighting sounds golden to me, as well as the reactor. So I guess that boils down to looking into some of the lower profile, high flow powerheads and possibly a new skimmer. If you have the room to incorporate a refugium, by all means do.

[Scott]

Thanks for the reply. That was the input that I was hoping to get but really surprised that I did since things can change quickly.

Both of the skimmers will be much too big. The Reef Mania has a 12" diameter with two large Sedra recirculating pumps. So, I will have to get a skimmer (I guess that is a topic for another post). Which leads me to the reactor. I am sure that I can use it but it is pretty large. I am sure that I won't use it right away but I am concerned with the flow rates. I am not sure that I can sustain the ph of the effluent with the low flows. I think that i will be turning the media into mush.

I went by Progressive today to look around. I talked to Beaver and at least learned that not much has changed in the hobby. I went through all the links i had to websites that I used to look as and only about half of them worked (WTF happened to Reefer Madness). I still have a lot of planning to do and I imagine that I will have a few things to sell but I want to make sure that I can't use them before I do.

Still open for suggestions or advice. I have been out of the loop for over three years and I am having to relearn some things.

Scott

[Scott]

I have almost definitely decided on barebottom (I already have Starboard) and a refugium too.

[Amphiprion]

As far as skimmers go, what kind of clearance are you planning on having? For that tank, especially being small, shoot for a needlewheel skimmer.

The hobby hasn't really changed much at all. Actually, the only real change was some progress in technology, but that's about it. Husbandry techniques, as well as learning more about the animals and how to care for them has somewhat stagnated recently, though. No new progress there, from what I've seen.

[Scott]

Wow, your quick. Are you the only other person that frequents the board?

I really expected that Zeovit or some of the other things that were emerging in the hobby would have changed things but I see that the standard that has been proven over and over again wins again.

I will start researching skimmers. I don't have a tank or stand that I am going to use yet so clearance is still to be determined.

[Amphiprion]

Wow, your quick. Are you the only other person that frequents the board?

Maybe . There are plenty of folks, but I drop by pretty often. I check it somewhat frequently in the evening.

I really expected that Zeovit or some of the other things that were emerging in the hobby would have changed things but I see that the standard that has been proven over and over again wins again.

For a lot of folks, Zeovit and other carbon dosing methodologies have been the answer. I honestly consider it a bandwagon effect, but that's me. There was a similar craze when I first started and it actually involved vodka like many of today's tanks. That being said, there are plenty of successful tanks that run it, but there's actually little real knowledge behind it and the overall effects are very poorly known. It's a bit of art sprinkled with voodoo, in my opinion. I like to know what I'm dealing with. Again, though, that's me.

I will start researching skimmers. I don't have a tank or stand that I am going to use yet so clearance is still to be determined.

Just to point you in a general direction for a smaller tank, look at Warner Marine, Deltec (expensive), Reef Octopus, Tunze, and the new CPR (Aero-somethings, can't remember). There are others out there, but I honestly haven't been skimmer shopping in years.

[Scott]

There was a Reef Octopus at Progressive today that looked like it would be a good skimmer (as opposed to red Sea and the other crap skimmers that I already know about.) Beaver said that it was a good skimmer as long as the pump was the new design. Do you know anything about this?

[Scott]

Wow, your quick. Are you the only other person that frequents the board?

Maybe . There are plenty of folks, but I drop by pretty often. I check it somewhat frequently in the evening.

I was just yanking your chain on that one. I just remember when the board here had 10+ members on every night and just before a meeting there could be three times that many. I can understand the waning effect, since it was something new at the time, but it seems like locals can be the best resource since they can meet, trade and know all the local shops.

[Amphiprion]

The Octopus Extreme models, I believe, use the Sicce pinwheel (or meshwheel) pumps. Beyond that, I'm not sure about the regular models. I know the regular ones added a bubble diffuser plate, but they may have made modifications to the usual Octopus brand pumps they normally use. I know the original ones, especially the smaller models, weren't all that great in action, but the extreme (and pro) models are great skimmers.

[Scott]

That's good information to know. I see that they are not some of the cheaper skimmers. I may need to inventory what I have and decide what I am going to use so that I can sell some stuff.

[Fishfood]

Scott... welcome back. I currently have a 29 or 30 gal tank. I don't like it... its too small. might I suggest a 40 breeder? I started with a fuge on my tank and it just got in the way and became a mess. I took it off and the tank was in just as good of shape. I have a vertec skimmer and it has been a decent skimmer. I also run T5s overdriven on an icecap 660. I've bleached most everything I put in the tank. I'm only running 3 bulbs and a 4th that is vho actinic. Space wise you are going to be limited with the acros if you want them to grow to a decent size. If you are going bare bottom I'd suggest the tunze nanostreams. I had 2 but it was too much with sand. I took one out. My tank has been very basic and I had good results until I switched bulbs the last time. Then I started losing thing.

[Amphiprion]

I had completely forgotten the Vertex IN skimmers. I haven't heard a single bad thing about them, myself. Very affordable for the performance, too.

[andy4499]

Scott, long time no see. Great to see you getting back in the hobby. I actually still have some of the equipment that you sold me several years ago. With what you described it sounds like you have got a great start on what you already have. I would have to agree with Andrew on his suggestions and the vortech pumps are awesome. I would love to put another one on my tank one day. As for skimmers I have always been a fan of the ASM skimmers my self. I have also used the Octopus skimmers and they are IMO a cheaper brand of the ASM style skimmer.

I think all the reef sites have gotten a lot slower over the past few years.

Once you do get your tank up and running I got plenty of things that I can frag.

[Fishfood]

Here is a question about the vortec pumps... would they be cost effective in a 29 gal tank vs going with some tunze nanostreams? I've never seen one in action but gather they are great pumps and if i had a large tank and wanted flow would go with something like that, but for a smaller tank I don't know if it would be the best option for the price.

As for Vertex skimmers.. when they first came out they had some issues. I think they have a new design now and the problem that they had was fixed early on(The impellers in the pumps were not cleaned and had small particles that wore down the magnets. I ended up getting a replacement impeller and have had no problems since. My only problem is the size of skimmer I got is too big for my tank. I really don't feed the tank but once a week and so there is nothing to pull from the water right now. Nothing is going in so nothing is coming out. I only have 3 very small gobies and they seem to find the food they need. They range from half an inch to an inch at best. When I was actually feeding the tank I wasn't pulling too much out either just because I think the skimmer I have is rated for 180 or so gal tanks and I only have a 29. I will say that I like it better than I did my ASM G3 and the price was better.